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Lag Comp Fix - Buffer Bloat

Discussion in 'Black Ops 2 Multiplayer Discussion' started by bmfk, Nov 27, 2012.

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  1. bmfk

    bmfk Colonel

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    Apparently some or a lot of players may be experiencing what is called Buffer Bloat. This guy tells you how to fix it in the video below. I've linked everything you may need from his YT below as well. Hopefully this works for some of us here as I know the connection has been abysmal at best sometimes.

    Essentially what I gathered is that you want to hardwire your connection directly to your modem and even at that some newer modems will still give you issues. Be sure to check the videos out as I'm not an expert on this.

    Buffer Bloat fix here


    Driftor's Analysis of Buffer Bloat


    Links
    Buffer Bloat site http://www.bufferbloat.net/
    Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bufferbloat
    Jim Gettys http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Gettys
    Codling our buffers http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7x7gIO0GYY
    Tool to check for Buffer Bloat http://netalyzr.icsi.berkeley.edu/
     
  2. bmfk

    bmfk Colonel

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    Now that I left those videos above, I'll leave this here for you to discuss and decide for yourself.

     
  3. t_almeida

    t_almeida Sergeant Major

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    lol @ this whole buffer bloat BS. My modem is my router and I've always been hardwired to it. Sounds like something Treyarch made up to get the attention off of them. The lag and connection issues are on their side but they won't admit it. I have few lag issues with MW3 and BO1 and ZERO issues with MW2. I obviously can't tell right now with CoD4 or WaW because it's all hackers so there's no point in trying. Almost no issues before they went to shit, though.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2012
  4. Razor777

    Razor777 A pretty princess.

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    If buffer bloat did cause a problem it would be lag, not lag compensation. Anyway if you want a game to dispell the buffer bloat myth try MW2. It exhibits none of the indicators that these videos suggest and it's one the fastest paced games of the entire series.
     
  5. Keyser Blowzé

    Keyser Blowzé If u don't no, now u no

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    http://www.cod247.com/showthread.php?t=79382&page=10

    ^^Polly.


    Can I ask what your technical expertise is that you so whimsically refute his assertion without even the smallest bit of emperical data or logical argment?

    Of course 3arch would rather it be someone else's issue so they aren't held responsible for the problem but at the same time there are usually multiple causal factors for something so complex.

    So one guy points to IW and says they don't know shit but 3arch does. The next 3arch game comes out and lag (or whatever factor it is) is unbearable then people bitch about 3arch. Then someone says it's the individual players internet connection. Then someone says it's the ping based matchmaking. Chances are many issues amplify each other into what is manifested on our television through our consols/pc's. Anyone who thinks it's ONLY one issue is likely blinded by malcontent and ignorance. Most likely there are a pluthora of reasons behind what is happening and why the game is so terrible to play at times.

    I don't doubt at all that "buffer bloat" could be one of the culprits. I'm sure 3arch has something to do with it and there is also the possibility that ones internet has a bit to do with it as well. There might be one primary reason for the "lag" but I'm sure there are many causal factors for it besides simply blaming that one variable.

    If nothing else the guy has an argument based on knowleadge AND experience and not simply conjecture. At least we have another potential resolution to this shitty situation.

    Trust me I wish it were ONLY 3arch. If it turns out to be the case the so be it but usually issues like this are pretty complex.
     
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  6. Keyser Blowzé

    Keyser Blowzé If u don't no, now u no

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    I don't believe he said buffer bloat happened with every game though. He is just saying that certain routers do it at random times iirc.
     
  7. bmfk

    bmfk Colonel

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    Yeah I noticed that after immediately after I posted the thread. I repped you ;)

    For once the search feature worked. Also, it's nice to have the info in one thread I suppose.
     
  8. t_almeida

    t_almeida Sergeant Major

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    Because I would be experiencing consistent lag issues in other games, not just Black Ops 2. I'm sure it's a ton of shit coming together to create a perfect shitstorm in BO2(theater mode, matchmaking, etc) but buffer bloat really sounds like something of a scapegoat. If buffer bloat really is an issue then why do other online games play just fine? True, I'm not an expert but common sense should be a factor here.

     
  9. Keyser Blowzé

    Keyser Blowzé If u don't no, now u no

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    Perhaps it's the buffer bloat in addition to however 3arch creates it's matchmaking. Perhaps the way the networking/connection is set up with BO2 allows buffer bloat to exacerbate the issue. The whole point is that it's a variable that possibly affects our gameplay. Why not see if this part of the issue and a partial remedy before so quickly dismissing it is what I'm saying.....
     
  10. Matt23

    Matt23 General

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    You will always get a better connection by connecting a ethernet cable from your modem to your xbox, the wireless system will create a little more lag then a cable system.
     
  11. flabulous_83

    flabulous_83 Privates Investigator

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    Well I think the easy way to find out is to have someone who has chronic lag issues and a new modem go buy an old modem and try it out. I suppose I could try. I have a Docsis 3.0 modem which is (was a year ago anyway) the best out there (from the cable company that is).

    To me, the 2nd video makes more logical sense. Maybe with all the "behind the scenes" things this game keeps track of (LOTS of info, seems to be more and more with each release), buffer bloat is really exaccerbating the problem and why lag seems to get worse and worse with each release...because there is more and more going on beneath the surface.

    Who knows. I am not smart enough. But it may be worth a try for someone with these chronic issues to buy an old modem and hardwire it directly and see what happens. I tell you what though, I would give my left (smaller) testicle to have the connection driftor had in his vid. Good god, why can't I get that?
     
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  12. rc10mike

    rc10mike Lieutenant General

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    As soon as I read about this issue a few weeks ago I tried. I connected my modem directly to my PS3 and didnt notice a difference. I use a top of the line modem as well as a top of the line router.
     
  13. wrxwagon03

    wrxwagon03 Commander

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    there are so many factors that will change your connection that don't include lag compensation. i'm sick of hearing dumb kids with 5/1 mb/s wireless connections bitching about treyarch is fucking them over

    the amount of people on some budget $20/month internet running a wireless connection bitching about how its the game's fault is astonishing
     
  14. der Jonesinho

    der Jonesinho Lieutenant General

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    Not everybody complaining has a shitty wireless connection. Some of us have tryed every solution somebody came up with to get the best out of their connection to get rid of the problems. And as one of those who tried nearly everything i can tell you that atleast 50% is screwed on the developers end. What ever it is and what ever fancy name it has, it needs to be fixed, changed, tweaked, what ever. As people mentioned before mw2 is the best example of a nearly flawless connection and i don't get why they screwed that thing
     
  15. TRBOPWR11

    TRBOPWR11 Corporal

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    While crappy internet is a factor, the game is not completely without fault.

    Unfortunately at the moment one of those crappy $20/month plans is all that is available in my area. If I play BO2 I constantly jump from 1-3 bars throughout an entire match. Playing solo, partied up, whatever. Put in MW3 and it is a steady 3 bar connection. Something about BO2 makes for a fubar'd connection when compared to previous titles.
     
  16. wrxwagon03

    wrxwagon03 Commander

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    you understand what lag compensation means, right?

    it punishes the person with the $100/month 75 mb/s internet. you would be the benefactor of lag compensation, so the fact that you have a shit connection would indicate to me that there is not any lag compensation affecting you
     
  17. Black Oops

    Black Oops Major General

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    The game is not completely at fault and yes it has to do with your modem and internet provider to
     
  18. AceVentura67

    AceVentura67 Recruit

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    The way buffer bloating is described in the wiki article, it sounds way more complicated than I assumed. I just figured larger buffer means it will wait to fill the buffer before sending the packets, which works good for video streaming and buffering web pages. But for gaming, you don't want any kind of wait, you want your current action to be sent immediately to avoid any kind of latency or lag. Which also brings up packet size, since it's sort of the same thing. The smaller the packet size, the sooner it will send that information since it fills faster. So having a smaller buffer and packet size seems like it would be ideal for multiplayer gaming, however most of the current routers/modems have larger buffers and packet sizes by default, and not many give you the option to change it. So getting an older modem which allows you to seems like the way to go.

    The only catch to all of this, is that your data passes through many routers to get to the host, so if those routers have large buffers/packet sizes, then that may negate anything you do on your end.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2012
  19. bmfk

    bmfk Colonel

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    Probably because you live in the sticks and your ping is well upwards of 200. That's unfortunate for you. What kind of internet is $20?! Hamster wheel powered, I'm sure.
     
  20. TRBOPWR11

    TRBOPWR11 Corporal

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    Yes, I understand that in theory Lag Comp should be helping me not hurting like many others here are experiencing. I was simply commenting that there is something with this game specifically that seems to screw with my connection that I don't experience when playing any other game online. Good internet, mediocre internet, or shit internet, this game appears to have some connection related issues.

    Ping is certainly an issue. A friend of mine has the same shit internet, but is closer to a sizable population center. It is actually possible to get into 75-100 ping lobbies unlike the more typical 150+ at my house, and the gameplay reflects the difference.

    I like to think they use something slightly more sizable like a raccoon or something...
     
  21. XxSou1FlyxX

    XxSou1FlyxX 1st Lieutenant

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    I'm connected straight to my modem. I don't have a router. The video on BB is BS.
     
  22. Major Flankage

    Major Flankage 1st Lieutenant

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  23. Justin_

    Justin_ General

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    Where is your head at? If it "was" buffer bloat this fucking video would have come out 4 COD's ago.. End of discussion.

    It is Lag Compensation. The reason is simple. 1 out of every 10 gamers have an extremely good connection. Under normal circumstances we would continually destroy the competition and their 1.5 meg connections. The masses would be pissed. So how do the developers keep the masses happy? Simply fuck the minority because hey they are only the 1%

    All about the paper boo boo.
     
  24. rc10mike

    rc10mike Lieutenant General

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  25. t_almeida

    t_almeida Sergeant Major

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    Situations like this in theory are not supposed to happen often but it's happening very often unfortunately. For whatever reason, CoD developers have not been able to implement lag compensation correctly. Most gamers are on this shit end of lag comp so why keep using it?

     
  26. Keyser Blowzé

    Keyser Blowzé If u don't no, now u no

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    Here is where my head is.....

    One of my degrees is in Electrical Engineering. This means that I have seen my share of complex issues and been asked to critique and have had my critiques evaluated (by people much smarter AND experienced than I) for erroneous data, fallacious logic and general inconsistencies.

    I understand that when there are issues with network connections, ping, packet loss, computer performance, nodal traffic, etc, etc, etc attempting to resolve said issues can be VERY complex.

    I'm not tryin to pull the "I have a degree" card in any way shape or form. But one thing that school taught me is that these things can get quite convoluted and there are often MANY facets to resolving an issue like this.

    To over simplify the situation and just blame one person, company or variable I think is a bit short sided.

    Unless someone here is a network engineer, has a CCIE, is well versed with all that the certification (or similar cert) entails then he/she is just performing and exercise in conjecture.

    If you want a SMALL idea of what some of this advanced networking curricula entails.....

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cisco_Career_Certifications

    I don't see a problem with attempting to resolve the situation piece by piece and ruling different culprits out. To me that is the way to handle a complex issue when a root cause analysis yields nothing solid.

    I don't disagree at all that this is all about money. IW, 3arch, SH are ALL trying to make money and will do so any way they can. They will do what they can to blame whomever they can even IF they are completely at fault. My sole contention is that most likely there are multiple facets to this issue and the mechanisms behind an issue such as this are quite complex. The old "KISS" adage I think is a bit lost with problems such as this.

    I also won't disagree that what the CoD devs do with their games and the connections to their servers is possibly the main cuprit here. But I don't see it as trivial to do what we can on our ends to improve the situation.
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2012
  27. kforce-k4

    kforce-k4 General

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    :jerkit:
    :jerkit:

    Activision doesnt want to spend a penny in hosting dedicated servers.
     
  28. Keyser Blowzé

    Keyser Blowzé If u don't no, now u no

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    Wow, very valid points you make there. Glad to see how in depth you went with your analysis. Can't find any point of yours I can factually refute. You should be a lawyer.

    :clap:
     
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  29. Gunzby

    Gunzby Lieutenant General

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    Meh I'll give it a try. I play wireless and haven't had a problem with it till now.

    One thing I've seen in blops 2 that I haven't seen in the others is split second screen stutter. When it happens I figured that it would be like other cod games where Warping happened. In those I would either see my connection go screwy, or everyone's connection went screwy (like lag switching). With the stuttering I haven't seen anything.
     
  30. der Jonesinho

    der Jonesinho Lieutenant General

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    I agree with you. This is no problem where you can just push one or two switches and everything is fine again. Imo the best argument out there why it is possibly the devs fault is mw2. A 3 year old game without any of the 'new fancy connection issues'. So they have access to the code of a nearly flawless multiplayer connection and should be able to compare this to their own code and find the mistakes. They don't need to reinvent the wheel, but still mess up. Thats what i don't get.
     
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